Tell us what you learned through you know, bringing this person to light, confronting him and dealing with the entire situation that we can learn from as a church. My husband and I actually bought our last car from our court and we had a great experience. And to do that, we must avoid falling into the trap of our Christian beliefs being pitted against culture in the public sphere of debate. https://world.wng.org/sites/default/files/issues/pdf/world_sep012018.pdf, Also, Id encourage you to read the website below. Amen. May God lead your next steps and may you find ways to use your gifts from a place of health. Hes one of the good guys. I mean, you dont need to be trying to fit a round peg into a square hole, because it is gonna manifest itself in bad ways. So, Mitch, how is it that a lawyer from Texas ended up representing victims of sexual harassment at a mega church in Chicago? And thats what, thats what you end up protecting right? Mike is a dear friend and Im sad this day has come. Frankly I find church to be excruciatingly lonely. 1 talking about this. And I feel that way with these pastors. A person whos not walking in the Spirit is susceptible to that type of behavior, even a senior pastor. Yes, I would view it far differently today. Today, Telling the Truthis heard anytime and anywhere, thanks to international radio programming, the internet, and our mobile app. He now coaches Pete Briscoe | Brookfield WI. I appreciate your taking time again away from your vacation to spend time with us. Absolutely horrible. But you had said you had gotten this manual and it was about, you know, basically how to be an elder and how to lead. But we dont have time on this podcast. I was the senior pastor of Bent Tree Bible Fellowship for nearly 30 years. Briscoe stepped down as senior pastor at the end of 2000 but remained involved in the church and active in overseas missions. Pete Briscoe, our pastor at our church came out in support of the Dyers, which was bold, and it was brave. Subscribe Sign up for my daily email devotionals and to stay in touch! Yep, thats rooted in pride. Yeah, they eventually did. And so when I looked at that in the context of James MacDonald going, you know what, thats the type of accountability that man needed and was denied. Let the Briscoes help you experience Life in all its fullness! Its all a Business and Power tool and stage for Virtue Signaling. Id like to share a few things as we navigate this loss together. He represented two women involved in the sex abuse scandal involving Bill Hybels. 1 talking about this. This is the kind of thing that you would expect from someone whos cruel and not in relationship with Jesus. Fortunately, we have not had so much as one complaint about any one of our pastors or staff members. It started as a simple tape duplication ministry in a home basement, using a reel-to-reel tape recorder linked to a dozen smaller recorders to duplicate the Briscoes' teaching. Yeah, I just saw you ran a story on MacDonalds massive mansion in Illinois being held in the name of Vanilla Bean LLC. So many people are looking the other way. Jill and Stuart came to the States from England. Im so grateful now for that heritage. Now youre a lawyer. I think its Pat Baranowskis story that ran in the New York Times that actually caused that. And so I hope your listeners understand what I mean, when I say this, thats how good God is that he can use people who are even morally bankrupt, to bring people to himself. And the thing that is astonishing to me, you used the issue of emotional vulnerability is that, you know, a lot of times our strengths are our weaknesses. Im against too many lawyers, and I think Im in a position to critique this. And what lessons can we learn from Willow Creeks mistakes? It grows over time. And Harvest was the same thing. But when we look at it from some practical ways that God used people to undo this, explain what you see as being the key forces. Jill A man who "dedicated his life to sharing Gods Word with the world" has died at the age of 91. I hope you have a great day and God bless. It is not a building. He has been married to Jill for more than 59 years and has three children and 13 grandchildren. Like if you go back and you actually read his books line-on-line, there are some things in there in those books where you go, For a pastor, that should be unacceptable. But he was attenuating his church culture and culture at large to him in his behavior. And where does whats legally expedient for our organization? Today were talking with Pete Briscoe, who served as the senior pastor for nearly three decades at Bent Tree Bible Fellowship in Carrollton, Texas, and now consults with and coaches pastors. Funny, whenever I would watch Bill Hybels preach online or speak at the GLS, and he would go into that quavering voice, tears-in-his-eyes, emotional mode, Id stop listening. At that age, I had never had someone in spiritual authority lie or manipulate me. Correct? But you have seen the the worst of it. And while youre at it, wed really appreciate it if you help us spread the word about the podcast by leaving a review and then please share the podcast on social media so more people can hear about this great content. So Mitch has a very unique perspective. And theyre born knowing how to do that. Churches sometimes need advocates outside their system. And they were no friends of ours during the Harvest investigation either. But it just has not really looked like true repentance in so many ways. To us, he was Stu, Dad and Poppa and we already miss him achingly." WebPete Briscoe answers that question by pointing us to Paul as the perfect example of one who speaks with tender boldness. Explain that. I was blown away. Hes also a strong believer and advocate for abuse victims. They were almost sacred and benevolent and unable to do wrong. And basically, my understanding is his cavalier attitude was, Well, Ill just pick up and Ill open a new church down the street [if] you dont you dont like me the way I am.. So if you think of Willow as being a living thing, we are willing to put other things to death on the altar of preserving that organism. Theyve got a little bit of the guide part. And presented them with the information, he essentially tossed it to the side and said, So what?, No consequences. This is simply a place where I share the message of Gods unadulterated grace through my preaching sermons and bible teaching. Through Petes teaching on Sundays and through various conversations with other staff members during the week, God shifted my perspective on what it means to live life in Christ one from my own efforts to please God to one of Christs efforts on my behalf to love me deeply, extravagantly, and permanently. For the next 90 minutes, Pete Briscoe enraptured us with his presentation of The Bema.. God showed him through that sermon how his trip was actually isolating and began a process of transformation. I wonder, I wonder what effect that might have had on them. I thought that emails could always be recovered, even after being erased, by a good IT person. Judson is located just 36 miles outside Chicago on a beautiful 90 acre campus. And this is a huge problem in the Evangelical Church in the southern baptist church, I mean, just absolutely massive problem where so often the predators covered up instead of brought to justice. God uses the weak things of this world to confound the strong, right? And I think that Bill Hybels created an advocacy structure around him by having that many lawyers on the board. which Hybels assented to including you know, repenting for his behavior and not talking about politics and some other things as well. Dear anonymous. Boy, and if more churches did that, how much pain and heartache among the sheep would have been spared? Growing up in a ministry family, Pete watched and learned from his parents and witnessed the reach and power of Telling the Truth 's media outreach. I think they can do it effectively. By the way, the best thing that was said in the recording is that if character isnt there, none of the regulations will matter, and if character is there, one doesnt need the regulations. I dont agree with a lot of his views, but he said something and it is true, we need to have, you know, church leader needs to have two voices, one for gathering the sheep and one for scaring away wolves. When I came onto our board, the terms that Pete Briscoe used were, guide, govern and guard. And I think policy governance has the governing part. Senior pastors dont need advocates. WebHi friend, I'm Pete Briscoe. Its scripturally rooted. He gave me a few new friends here and there, people to pray with, to share with, to be coworkers in some small ministry, etc. You know, when you have somebody like Bryan Loritts, who when hes talking about why when he was at a former church, he didnt disclose to the church that they had a sexual predator among them for six months. I attended Willow for seven years. It is a collection of people. But I guess this is the question so many are asking is, Can anybody be in those kind of jobs with the kind of responsibility that is put on one human, one person to lead thousands of people? And so many looking to him for vision for leadership for everything. Now, I coach pastors and business leaders in communications and self-care. Scott Dyer was the worship pastor at Bent Tree Bible fellowship. And its pervasive, and people are, theyre using it. Pete was preaching from Hebrews, and he was making the New Covenant come alive before all of us. I think that was a move of God, a move of the Holy Spirit. And I think you hit the nail on the head. 1 talking about this. David Jankowski. But now my faith in the whole institution is shattered. Subscribe Sign up for my daily email devotionals and to stay in touch! The Elder Board has accepted Petes decision, and his resignation is effective March 31, 2019. So thanks again. Why did so many look the other way for so long? I was a member of WCCC for many years. JULIE ROYS 23:38, What I meant by that comment is that unanimity didnt create any problems for the board and senior pastor because everyone agreed with James MacDonald. It took a variety of forms. Im good friends with Vonda Dyer, who worked at Willow and was one of the women who bravely came forward with her story about her interactions with Bill Hybels. Those are the good guys. And the people in this story are complex characters. That goes to the guarding role that Attorney Mitch shared. And you made the statement that if you have the character to lead, you dont need a manual. Well Mitch, one of the things Ive never discussed is that we used to attend Willow Creek. I just want to say this was not someone who acted on any behavior at our church, but had someone who was in the process of grooming someone else. Then, I did what all good Christian college students did at that time I acquired a boot-leg copy of the drama and listened to it several times on my own. But what happens when there is a sheep within the flock who needs to be defended? The thief knows how to how to get through that lock, right? WebHi friend, I'm Pete Briscoe. Really what it is, Julie, if we want to get down to it and go to spiritual or biblical terms, these are these are works of the flesh when were not led by the Spirit. Volunteers monitored the process in real time, turning over cassettes at the appropriate time to record on the second side. Okay. So appreciate. Yeah, I think youre gonna be waiting a while. Im Julie Roys. WebHi friend, I'm Pete Briscoe. How are you? For the next 90 minutes, Pete Briscoe enraptured us with his presentation of The Bema.. Do we have a theology of goodness at our church? Manipulative theatrics. The thing that is so terrifying is that someone who has been a senior pastor in an organization like that is not beyond it. I appreciate you so much and look forward to visiting with you again soon. You can choose from more than 60 majors and learn in a Christian environment known for its spiritual values, leadership opportunities, and strong financial aid. Vonda was at one time the director of Willow Creeks vocal ministry, and she was one of the first women to come forward and speak publicly about Bill Hybels alleged sexual misconduct. At the end of the day the aftermath of destruction is felt on so many levels by so many people and we all react differently in our humanness. I mean, it was a great time. It manifested at the Human Resources level. And yet youre still in a megachurch, multi-site church. You know, Hybels daughter had her own book on Oprahs book club. One of those women is Vonda Dyer. Hes a complex character. But you lose the guarding mechanism, which I think in todays in todays cultural moment, its probably the most important aspect of eldering. Well, since you brought it up, youre gonna youre gonna have to address the Vanilla Bean. So thank you. To me, Bill did not come across as a predator, flirty or suggestive with women. The fact that, I dont know. To us, he was Stu, Dad and Poppa and we already miss him achingly." I know about the deleted emails. I was the senior pastor of Bent Tree Bible Fellowship for nearly 30 years. Board members selected in such a way are unlikely to honor their fiduciary duty ahead of their desire to please the board chairman or senior pastor. Continue Reading The Upper Room: John 15 Posted by Nate Murray Vanilla orchids are actually pollinated by hand in most places. And yet here we see a church thats ostensibly about serving God, and its about proclaiming the gospel and yet this is happening within the church. They have a responsibility to the larger church to speak. WebSince that time he has ministered on every continent, written more than 40 books, pastored a church for 30 years, and founded a media ministry called Telling the Truth which now broadcasts daily worldwide. "For many of you, he was preacher, pastor, mentor or friend. Im so glad that theyre godly men like you serving. He makes sure the good things stay in the church and the bad things go out. Lawyers are, by definition, advocates, right? It took me a long time to agree that he had done the things of which he had been accused. Like so many of you, I love Pete. He has been married to Jill for more than 59 years and has three children and 13 grandchildren. Its M-I-L-G-R-A-M the Milgram experiment, but basically American researchers were trying to figure out after World War II, why so many in German society were willing to go along with the Nazis or go along with their leadership, do incalculably horrible things to people. And so, you know, as a lawyer on the board, youre not absolved from the obligation of complying with the mandates of Scripture. Would you consider making a tax-deductible donation to help our journalists continue to report the truth and restore the church? He, Becky and their kids have been part of the fabric of BT for so long, it is Pete reminds us that our goal is not to win arguments, but to win people. Then, I did what all good Christian college students did at that time I acquired a boot-leg copy of the drama and listened to it several times on my own. Because it was lawyers advice, you know, and its like, where does the word of God play into our decision making? And theres a lot of people asking, Is that just too great a burden to ever put on one person? How do you respond to that? Pete Briscoe @petebriscoe 12 Dec 2021. About Stuart and Jill Briscoe Petes teaching and emphasis on the sufficiency of Christ leaves an indelible mark on so many of our souls. Pete has offered to Stuart Briscoe died on August 3 "of natural causes unexpectedly" according to a tweet from his son, Pete Briscoe. So when you have a culture thats willing to, you know, exfoliate spoiliate, destroy documents in order to preserve a narrative, theres really very little that the culture will not accomplish at the cost of innocent people. In fact, I know some of them. Pete Briscoe, our pastor at our church came out in support of the Dyers, which was bold, and it was brave. Much has been written on establishing criteria for board member selection. So there were more than 10 women that came forward and said that there was sexual misconduct by Bill Hybels. And Im good friends with her husband Scott Dyer as well. Leave them alone. I can see the elders (more than half of which were women), and people in general saying, It was only a hug. And I think there is a healthy fear. That is not a matter of policy. Theres a lot of church boards that operate that way. I would probably have been among those who defended Bill saying, He couldnt have done these things; Hes too strong of a Christian leader. I see this culture as similar to the Corinthian church with the man who was involved with his fathers wife. You have to have unity among your vocational staff at the church about, you know, key issues like how do we treat other people? Well, again, Joining me today is Mitch Little a partner with Scheef & Stone in Frisco, Texas. Bent Tree family and friends of Bent Tree, we invite you to post here (or on social media) your comments of encouragement, gratitude, blessing, remembrance, and tribute to the many long years our brother Pete and sister Libby have poured out their lives for the building up of Christs church. So grateful for those who did and Scot McKnight who came out with a just a powerful, I remember when his blog hit and he said, Every elder has to resign. And within what, wasnt it a week, all of them resigned. I wasnt throughout the representation. Thank God I have Jesus. Continue Reading The Upper Room: John 15 Posted by Nate Murray And I think it wasnt a problem, Mitch, because everybody always agreed with whatever the senior pastor wanted. Okay. And really, I came back to the Lord at Willow and He used that church to help me reestablish my relationship with Him and with His church. But then its my understanding too, that when these women met with the elders, the level of bullying and abuse that they were subjected to, was such that I know Vonda told me there were elders in tears at the end of this, of how pervasive the abuse was, I dont know how specific you can be but can you give people an idea of, of what actually happened to these women that were abused? And not elevated above it. I dont know the answer but rampant clergy abuse just took my discontentment to a whole new level. Likewise. Oh Well, and I appreciate your service to the church. Not so much at Willow till after, because I was so wrapped up in the Harvest stuff at that time and the Moody stuff that I didnt really have the capability or the bandwidth to do much reporting about Willow. WebLearn More About Pete Today - Pete Briscoe God loves you to distraction, There is nothing you can do to make Him love them more or less, And, that Life with this Lover God is rich beyond description, regardless of your performance. I havent seen a lot of true owning, true repenting, true confessing. Well, early on in the process after the Tribune article, we had to make a decision, How are we going to fight a machine of this size that is basically promulgating lies about these women and their families and their supporters? And I reached out to people that I already knew within, you know, the watch blogging community. This was something that was very deeply ingrained in their culture. And the Nancy Ortberg situation, a hug that lasted too long. In context, I think my meaning becomes clear as I say soon after, agreeing with Mitchs assessment that unanimity is bad: Absolutely horrible. Everything started to make sense. I think he lost it. That way, youll never miss an episode. So he said something about so and sos clothing. So I want you to think about this while you know Bill Hybels is being accused of doing awful things by a dozen women. Whats our theology? The church is nondenominational and has woman pastors and elders. And now lets put that in the past. Willow did not want to reckon with the deformed culture that had manifested underneath Bills leadership. Pete is the son of Jill and Stuart Briscoe. I think the larger the platform, the more rigorous the accountability needs to be. And that was how Bill deformed his accountability structure. Please note, our website requires JavaScript to be supported. Well, one thing I did want to cover, and our time is getting to an end, but I know that you have dealt with having a sexual predator within your church. I think thats dangerous. So you caught them before that anything actually happened? https://www.billionbibles.com/voice-of-the-martyrs.html. Its good to be visiting with you again. And which really makes me sad because theyve had a change in leadership. I dont think I could survive the corruption I see today had I not seen so much thats good and beautiful in the church growing up. And he came back and said, I cant do this anymore.. And theres an element to which a church like Willow Creek was a global church, right? Its really pride. Id like to share a few things as we navigate this loss together. Put a skin tag on it or a flesh tag. And Willow just, they got killed because they wouldnt respond and say the truth. WebPete Briscoe, Stuart and Jills youngest son, was a key contributor to the ministrys teaching team from 2003 to 2021. And I remember you saying. Continue Reading The Upper Room: John 15 Posted by Nate Murray Briscoe stepped down as senior pastor at the end of 2000 but remained involved in the church and active in overseas missions. Like so many of you, I love Pete. The Elder Board has accepted Petes decision, and his resignation is effective March 31, 2019. The cover up of his behavior manifested at the elder board level. I am thrilled to be here. Can you imagine how many books that sold her? WebBriscoe says that he wants Bent Tree to be a place where people can agree to disagree over this issue. Pete Briscoe @petebriscoe 12 Dec 2021. It was everything from Vonda Dyers situation of being asked to come up to Bills room and talk leadership and a forced kiss, you know, a grab around the waist. I was blown away. So Mitch, thank you so much for taking the time to join me today. Well, to answer your question, very bad. Your browser does not support JavaScript. How do spot a safe pastorand can. There was a period of time, Ill call, The Great Loneliness after that Chicago Tribune article came out, where they were radioactive. He currently leads a multi-faceted media ministry called Telling the Truth which he shares with his parents Stuart and Jill Briscoe. And I was sitting in my office one day and Vonda picked up the phone and gave me a call and kind of told me what was coming down the pike in terms of the Chicago Tribune article that basically lit the fuse on that entire situation at Willow. He has been married to Jill for more than 59 years and has three children and 13 grandchildren. The other thing I wanted to talk to you about in you mentioned this in earlier discussion we had about the identity of elders and how so often, and I dont think its just elders, I think its a lot of the senior pastor leadership and staff that their identity tends to become enmeshed with the success or failure of the organization theyre a part of. Lawyer for Bill Hybels Victims Shares Inside Story. Yes, probably a number of your listeners are aware of the situation where the Ortbergs and Mellados had tried to report to the board an alleged long term affair that Bill Hybels was engaged in and the church hired an outside investigator to investigate the situation. And that that was something that taught you an awful lot about how elder board should deal with sexual impropriety or sexual abuse within their own walls. We needed to go to the hills and fight as guerillas, you know, what is guerrilla warfare? But heres what happened when Scot criticized them publicly. I hope someday I can overcome this cynicism because I need Church as it should be. Well, and it troubles me too, that so many of our Christian organizations seem to be more beholden to lawyers advice and counsel than they do the Word of God. Hi Julie, my name is Teresa and I was wondering if Voice of the Martyr was a good place to donate. it is. This is just the way things are in Corinth. I totally agree with you Julie on how I viewed the Clergy and Church growing up. Serving in the role of elder is a huge responsibility. And yet, they lost the PR battle, which is unbelievable. If you want to know what grooming looks like in the context of church, every elder at a church of any size should read this book. And that set the course for some of these more severe things to continue happening, and then to even get more and more severe. They had so many churches, thousands of churches coming on board and being a part of those. About Stuart and Jill Briscoe And gratitude is where we must go in this time, as Kurt Baxter reminded us on Sunday. Destroyed by a staff person is my understanding. And these men are good actors. WebIt is with heavy hearts that the Elders of Bent Tree announce that Pete Briscoe has submitted his resignation as Senior Pastor. John and Nancy Ortberg had been at Willow Creek as pastors. Welcome to the Roys report, a podcast dedicated to reporting the truth and restoring the church. I heard an elder once describe his role as a glorified sanitation engineer. The church is literally a collection of people. Im doing well but probably not as well as you because youre on vacation in Florida. I dont know. If you go back through Willow Creeks archives, you can see all the, you know, the authors of books who came in and were platformed at Willow Creek. You have to have a strong culture of accountability. I cant do this authentically anymore. And as hard as the last year and a half has been, I applaud him for that. And this is whats so difficult. When you say the IT department, its my understanding you came into some information about emails getting destroyed. And this is one of the I think exciting things. I followed the Harvest situation, which I think is its own it, you know, separate facts. Thats what he was. How does our elder board navigate things differently with that Pastor? And you mentioned to me that there were some stop signs along the way. Pete reminds us that our goal is not to win arguments, but to win people. Do you understand what Im saying? So its more than flirty words or suggestions. To speak again, Joining me today is Mitch little a partner with Scheef & in! Sacred and benevolent and unable to do wrong seen a lot of people,... Discontentment to a whole New level learn from Willow Creeks mistakes forward to visiting with you Julie on how viewed. Whole institution is shattered simply a place where I share the message of Gods unadulterated grace through my sermons! Truth which he shares with his parents Stuart and Jill Briscoe Petes teaching and emphasis the. About emails getting destroyed Creeks mistakes Frisco, Texas misconduct by Bill Hybels about one... Real time, as Kurt Baxter reminded us on Sunday Tree announce that pete Briscoe used,! Makes me sad because theyve had a great experience govern and guard actually... Other way for so long, Joining me today is Mitch little a partner with &... Represented two women involved in the New York Times that actually caused that their! That might have had on them is simply a place where people agree! Culture at large to him for that making a tax-deductible donation to help journalists... Find ways to use your gifts from a place of health the truth that if you the! The Truthis heard anytime and anywhere, thanks to international radio programming, the terms that pete used... For many of our pastors or staff members Poppa and we had a in! Have had on them very bad reached out to people that I already knew,... Really looked like true repentance in so many of you, he tossed... Leaves an indelible mark on so many of you, I love pete organization like that is not beyond.! The clergy and church growing up steps and may you find ways to use your gifts a. 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